The Evangelical Universalist Forum

SNIPPETS FROM MY HARD COPY UR LIBRARY

Infant Salvation
Believers in eternal torment are divided in their opinion about the fate of infants who die.
Some, who believe in God’s sovereign election of the “few”, also believe that non-elect babies who die will spend eternity suffering in hell. I have heard that John Calvin said, “There are babies a span long in hell”.
Others consider this unfair, and assert that infants who die will spend eternity in heavenly bliss. This of course is true, but not because the child is innocent. It’s true because the Scriptures teach that God intends to save everyone from everything that they need to be saved from.
A few years ago there was a story in a Montreal paper about an Ohio lady who drowned her baby in the bathtub. Her defense was that she loved the baby so much that she wanted to make sure that her child would not have to suffer forever in hell. After serving a sentence she remarried, had another child and drowned it for the same reason. She trusted that God would forgive her because her intention, though warped by false theology, was for the good of her children.
The jury decided that she was mentally ill, BUT WAS SHE? The simple pragmatic fact remains that if evangelicals are right, her two infants will spend eternity in heavenly bliss because she loved them so much that she insured, by killing them, that this will be so.
Apparently, believers in eternal torment believe that there is a magical split-second in time before which a child, if they die, will go to heaven, and after which, if they die will spend eternity suffering in hell. They call this “the age of accountability”.
If I believed this nonsense I might take a gun into the largest maternity ward in Toronto and before the police arrived, kill every infant who had just been born. This would cause an enormous amount of suffering to the parents, but this wouldn’t matter much in the long run, because probably most of them (according to evangelical theology) are destined to suffer forever in hell anyway, so why not save their babies from the same fate?
Don’t try to argue that what I would be doing would be wrong *(Thou Shalt Not Kill). The fact remains that my act would, in fact insure the babies’ eternal salvation. If evangelicals right, then infanticide would certainly be one of the most effective ways of “saving souls”. Besides, God forgives murder, especially when it is done for such a noble, though misguided cause.
Sure, they would lock me away in an institution, but I would spend my life reveling in the glow of the emotional high of knowing that I had, beyond any shadow of a doubt (even in the mind of evangelicals) guaranteed the salvation of the babies that I had killed.
Folks, the actual truth about the matter is much more sane and blessed. The Scriptures teach that salvation is all of the Lord, and He will not fail to save everyone of us according to His own timing. No one will be able to boast in His presence and say “I have saved my self from eternal hell by exercising my faith in God’s provision.” God will get all of the glory for everyone’s salvation.

The important issue never should be “what is right or what is wrong”. The only really important issue is, “What is God going to do with the person who is wrong? !” The Scriptures teach that God will fit every one of us into His master-plan in a positive way, and He will use our temporary involvement with sin to teach us the lessons that He wants us to learn. As my 104 year old Dad often said, “That’s what makes Him God!”
(Afterthought) - If abortionists are, for all practical purposes, among the most effective “soul-savers” in the world, why do evangelicals get so upset with them?!

  • Believers in eternal torment kill each other in war for less worthy causes!

INSANITY

Does traditional Christianity cause insanity? Many seem to think so. This video is the story a pastor and his daughter of their journey from the traditional turn or burn gospel to the Victorious Gospel of Jesus Christ. Like it on Facebook and please send links to your family and friends. Gary Amirault

youtube.com/watch?v=gDnZRms3XZE

It is absurd to say that Jesus would not be doing it !!!
godfire.net/eby/circularity.html

CONSEQUENSES OF TEACHING THE DOCTRINE OF “ETERNAL HELL”
tentmaker.org/articles/hells_fruit.html

greater-emmanuel.org/Hope4You/consequences.html

Child Sacrifice in Christianity? Yep!! Watch:
Christian Molech Worship by Tentmaker Ministries:
youtube.com/watch?v=xKuhBdWbJXQ

IS GOD STRONG ENOUGH? – Kenneth Larson
“For which of you, wanting to build a tower, is not first seated to calculate the expense, to see if he has the wherewithal?- lest at some time, he laying a foundation and not being strong enough to finish up, all those beholding should begin to scoff at him, saying that 'This man begins building and is not strong enough to finish up!’” Lk. 14:28-30. God’s perfect foundation is Christ Jesus. 1 Cor. 3:11; Is. 28:16; Lk. 20:17; Heb. 5:7-9. What God is building on His foundation is a perfect, reconciled creation. Ro. 8:20, 21; Col. 1:15-20; 1 Cor. 15:20-28; Phil. 2:5-11.
God is strong enough to reconcile all, for He controls all hearts. Is. 26:12; 2 Chronicles 30:12; Rev. 17:17. God has a purpose- a will for creation. Eph. 1:9-11; 3:11. God “wills that all mankind be saved and come into a realization of the truth.” 1 Tim. 2:4. And “All that Yahweh delights He does, in the heavens and on earth, in the seas and every abyss” Ps. 135:6; see Is. 46:10 and John 1:29.

Christ will draw all to Himself. Jn. 12:32. Our stubbornness and unbelief are no match for Almighty God. Romans 11:32. “Not stronger than He are we!” 1 Cor. 10:22. God is a perfect Savior, and He is more than strong enough to save all. 1 Tim. 4:9-11; Is. 53; Matt. 19:25, 26.

IT IS WELL WITH MY SOUL – HORATIO STAFFORD

Though trials should come, let this blessed assurance control,
that Christ has regarded my helpless estate, and shed His own blood for my soul. :exclamation:

ITCHING EARS

Sometimes believers in eternal torment and annihilation like to say that 2Tim. 4:3&4 about a time coming when people will have “itching ears” and will turn to believing myths or fables, refers to believers in universal salvation.
But I think it refers to believers in eternal torment and annihilation instead because most Christians closest to the time of Jesus believed in universal salvation.

ETers and ANers like to have their itching ears scratched by listening to sermons based on the myth or fable that only people who believe like they do before they die are going to avoid suffering forever in “hell” or be annihilated.

Universalism The Prevailing Doctrine Of The Christian Church During Its First Five Hundred Years
tentmaker.org/books/Prevailing.html
The author, J.W. Hanson wrote “The purpose of this book is to present the evidence of the prevalence in the early centuries of the Christian church, of the doctrine of the final holiness of all mankind. The author believes that the following pages show that Universal Restitution was the faith of the early Christians for at least the First Five Hundred Years of the Christian era. He has aimed to present irrefragable proofs that the doctrine of Universal Salvation was the prevalent sentiment of the primitive Christian church.

The salient statements and facts in all which will be found in these pages show that the most and ablest of the early fathers found the deliverance of all mankind from sin and sorrow specifically revealed in the Christian Scriptures.”

And they were reading the Bible in its original language!

MYTHS - Kenneth Larson

“…they will be turning their hearing away from the truth, yet will be turned aside to myths." 2 Tim. 4:4

Scripture: “And if you are loving those loving you, what thanks [grace] is it to you? For sinners also are loving those loving them. And if you should be doing good to those doing good to you, what thanks [grace] is it to you? For sinners also are doing the same. And if you should ever be lending to those from whom you are expecting to get back, what thanks [grace] is it to you? For sinners also are lending to sinners, that they may get back the equivalent. Moreover, be loving your enemies, and be doing good, and be lending, expecting nothing from them, and your wages will be vast in the heavens, and you will be sons of the Most High, for He is kind to the ungrateful and wicked.” Luke 6:32-35.
Myth: “God expects something from us (to exercise our free will) before His grace will be of any benefit to us. God loves His enemies, and will give the most ungrateful and wicked among them the wages of sin (death) forever.”

Scripture: “For to vanity was the creation subjected, not voluntarily, but because of Him Who subjects it, in expectation that the creation itself, also, shall be freed from the slavery of corruption into the glorious freedom of the children of God.” Romans 8:20, 21.
Myth: “Satan and Adam subjected the creation to vanity. The creation will be freed from the slavery of corruption by the Almighty, by granting incorruptibility to a few, and annihilating the rest.”

Scripture: “…Not one is seeking out God. All avoid Him…” “Consequently, then, it is not of him who is willing, nor of him who is racing, but of God, the Merciful." Romans 3:11, 12; 9:16.
Myth: “Seek God and you’ll be saved. Your salvation depends on how you exercise your free will. If you’re lost, it will be your own fault.”

Scripture: “For God locks up all together in stubbornness, that He should be merciful to all.” Romans 11:32
Myth: “It was Lucifer’s doing, and Adam’s. God is merciful to all us humans because He gives us a chance to escape the consequences of their sins.”

Scripture: “and through Him to reconcile all to Him (making peace through the blood of His cross), through Him, whether those on the earth or those in the heavens. And you, being once estranged and enemies in comprehension, by wicked acts, yet now He reconciles" Colossians 1:20, 21.
Myth: “God wishes He could reconcile all the estranged on earth and in the heavens, but He has to have cooperation from those on earth; He can’t do it alone. As for those estranged in the heavens, they’re hopeless.”

J. Preston Eby 2

TESTIMONY OF TED JONES
My wife Helen and I spent forty years of our lives distributing Christian literature. We are in our seventies now. The following testimony video by J. Preston Eby is an example of the power of literature. One critic thinks that Preston should have let the book burn up that his dad threw into the fire. But as a result of reading that book instead of letting it burn up, Preston later wrote the following expositional series based on his further studies of the Bible.

TESTIMONY VIDEO OF J. PRESTON EBY
youtube.com/watch?v=JEwcWR8kxUs&feature=sub

See the following great sixteen chapter introductory series to ultimate reconciliation. J. Preston Eby does a thorough job covering many aspects of the topic. Fundamental reading for any person interested in studying universal salvation from a solid biblical perspective.
Highly Recommended!
godfire.net/eby/saviour_of_the_world.html

John 3:16
DEATH AND DESTRUCTION ARE NOT ETERNAL - Kenneth Larsen
Jesus knew that John 3:16 was not the end of the story…that’s why He continued to John 3:17 and talked about the salvation of all mankind!!!
Jesus makes no attempt to use verse 16 to negate or qualify verse 17. He simply makes both statements side by side as if both are completely true. The reason He does this is that both ARE completely true.

We see this over and over in Scripture, especially in the writings of Paul – a statement about people who have faith now (maybe a warning or exhortation or encouragement about the benefits of taking part in the kingdom of God a.k.a. the next two ages of life on earth) right next to a statement about how Christ accomplished the justification of all men. See Romans 3:23-24 and 5:18 and their contexts for example. This is no big deal; none of these statements negate, qualify (change), or contradict each other, because both concepts are 100% true. Some will be saved from death early and take part in the kingdom of God, and everyone else will be saved from death later.

To attempt to use some statements (about those who get saved early) to negate the others statements (about the eventual salvation of all) is to butcher the common sense rules of language and communication. We would never do this to each other in everyday communication; the only reason people try to do it to Jesus and Paul is because they cannot bring themselves to believe the plain statements about the eventual salvation of all mankind.

If I said to my kids, “Those of you who help me clean the yard today will get to go to a movie with me tomorrow, and next week I will take the rest of you to a movie,” I have made it very clear that all the kids will eventually go to the movies. My two statements do not contradict each other or negate each other in any way. This is the exact same thing Jesus does in John 3:16 and 17 – He makes two equally true statements. Yet “hell mindset” Christians try to make one statement negate the other in order to fit their preconceived inherited ideas.

“What About how the Bible says that those who do not believe will perish or be destroyed?”
tentmaker.org/FAQ/perish.htm

THE NARROW DOOR AND MANY CALLED BUT FEW CHOSEN

The language is entirely confined to the present.
“Lord, are there few that be ‘saved’?” The literal rendering is: “Are those being saved few?” The question relates entirely to the number then, at that time that were entering the narrow door and accepting Christ. Also, many were called to accept Christ through the apostolic preaching of that time period, but few were chosen by way of their acceptance of that call.

What it does not mean is that anyone will suffer eternal torment or be annihilated;
because we know that sooner or later God will have (wants if you like) all men to be saved (1 Timothy 2:4)
It is God’s “pleasure” that all mankind be saved.
And “God is operating all in accord with the counsel of His will” (Ephesians 1:11).

Change it to read “in accord with the counsel of what He wants if you like.
Because God says
“My counsel shall stand.
I will do all my pleasure
(the saving of all mankind is part of the pleasure that God wants)
Yea I have spoken it.
I will also bring it to pass.
I have purposed it.
I will also do it.”
Isaiah 46:10,11

Job 23:13 “But he stands alone, and who can oppose Him?
He does whatever he pleases.
(the saving of all mankind is part of what He wants that pleases Him).

Isaiah 55:11 so is my word that goes out from my mouth:
It will not return to me empty,
but will accomplish what I desire
and achieve the purpose for which I sent it.
(the saving of all mankind is part of all of which God desires or wants)

So we see God does all His pleasure, He does whatever He pleases, and His word accomplishes that which He desires.
His pleasure, that which He desires and pleases Him is what He wants.

His will = What He wants
What does He want?
THE SALVATION OF ALL MANKIND
Why will it happen?
Because God Himself will see to it that it gets done.

Any cooperation towards our salvation is the result, not the cause of God laying hold on us by His saving grace and causing Jesus to be “choice” in our heart, just like it was in the case of Lydia and Saul of Tarsus.

The opinions of exactly how God will achieve universal salvation may differ from UR to UR just like the opinions of ETers also vary from person to person about what the Bible teaches about salvation.

NOT EVERYONE – Matt. 7:21

If these words were taken literally, then no one at all would enter the kingdom of Heaven because, at least for a period of time EVERYONE doesn’t do the will of the Father.
According to Rom. 3:10-18 EVERYONE starts out in the condition described in those verses.

All that Jesus meant by that statement is that NO UNREPENTANT SINNER will ever enter the kingdom of Heaven.

But we know that a time is coming when there will be no unrepentant sinners left in existence.

We know this because God “will have all men to be saved” (1 Timothy 2:4)
It is God’s “pleasure” that all mankind be saved.
And “God is operating all in accord with the counsel of His will” (Ephesians 1:11).

Change it to read “in accord with the counsel of what He wants” if you like.
Because God says
“My counsel shall stand.
I will do all my pleasure
(the saving of all mankind is part of the pleasure that God wants)
Yea I have spoken it.
I will also bring it to pass.
I have purposed it.
I will also do it.”
Isaiah 46:10,11

Job 23:13 “But He stands alone, and who can oppose Him?
He does whatever he pleases.
(the saving of all mankind is part of what He wants that pleases Him).

Isaiah 55:11 so is my word that goes out from my mouth:
It will not return to me empty,
but will accomplish what I desire
and achieve the purpose for which I sent it.
(the saving of all mankind is part of all of which God desires or wants)

So we see God does all His pleasure, He does whatever He pleases, and His word accomplishes that which He desires.
His pleasure, that which He desires and pleases Him is what He wants.

His will = What He wants
What does He want?
THE SALVATION OF ALL MANKIND
Why will it happen?
Because God Himself will see to it that it gets done.

Just like in the case of Lydia (whose heart the Lord opened, Acts 16:14) and Saul of Tarsus (Acts 9:1-8), our cooperation to be saved is the result, not the cause, of God laying hold on us by His sovereign grace and causing Jesus to be “choice” in our heart.

The timing of the salvation of everyone is under God’s sovereign control.
God arranges everything so each person will be saved according to His perfect timing for each individual.

NOTHING gives me greater pleasure than to guide people to the reasons why I see an infinitely different God in the Bible than the one I was taught in the several different eternal punishment churches I attended during years gone by and in the Bible school from which I graduated.
I’m 79 years old.

CHRIST TRIUMPHANT - Thomas Allin
tentmaker.org/books/ChristTriumphant.htm

CHRIST TRIUMPHANT - Thomas Allin
tlchrist.info/filealin.htm

NOW IS “A” DAY OF SALVATION
(not “the” day of salvation)

auburn.edu/~allenkc/today.html

125 NUTS

In my opinion, this book blows the theological ship of the Calvinists clean out of the water.

125 NUTS FOR CALVINISTS TO CRACK – C.R. Bierbower
(another book in my hard copy UR library)

“Although a Calvinist myself for more than thirty years, the scriptures declaring God’s infinite love, and the plain teachings of Jesus my Lord on the subject of love, mercy and truth, finally sank my theological ship. This left me searching for the truth as it is in Jesus. Finally I was convinced by the overwhelming number of Scriptures that our great God and Heavenly Father truly does, without partiality, love the whole world, and He will in His own time and in His own way finally reconcile all men unto Himself.

Arminianism and Calvinism both represent each other as the method for God’s work in salvation, and both vigorously reject the final reconciliation of all men. It is my purpose in this book to point out to my Calvinistic brethren the inconsistency of their interpretation of Scripture.”

And IMO, C.R. does a very good job of pointing out the inconsistency of the Calvinist interpretation of Scripture.”

Calvinism, Arminianism, or Christian Biblical Universalism
Which view of salvation is true?

Two good expositions specifically answering that question!

ABSOLUTE ASSURANCE IN JESUS CHRIST – Charles Slagle
sigler.org/slagle/absolute.htm

THE LAW OF CIRCULARITY – J.Preston Eby
godfire.net/eby/circularity.html

OPPOSERS OF CHRISTIAN UNIVERSALISM REFUTED

COMMON ARGUMENTS ADDRESSED
Good news of God’s love for all mankind - find it here at Tentmaker
tentmaker.org/FAQ/index.html
and
Quick Find: Links to Information on Hell and Universal Salvation
tentmaker.org/bloglinks.htm

CONSEQUENCES OF ETERNAL TORMENT THEOLOGY
tentmaker.org/articles/hells_fruit.html

BIBLE THREATENINGS EXPLAINED
tentmaker.org/books/BibleThr … ained.html

THE SCHOLARS CORNER THE CENTER FOR BIBLE STUDIES IN CHRISTIAN UNIVERSALISM
tentmaker.org/ScholarsCorner.html

UNIVERSAL SALVATION UNIVERSITY
richardwaynegarganta.com/universalsalvation.htm

RESPONSES TO CURRENT CHAMPIONS OF ETERNAL TORMENT THEOLOGY

Don Hewey
gtft.org/Library/condon/Question … nswers.htm
saviourofall.org/opposers/HeweyOnAion.html
saviourofall.org/opposers/He … leOne.html
saviourofall.org/opposers/He … leTwo.html
saviourofall.org/opposers/He … Three.html

Eric Landstrom
saviourofall.org/opposers/Landstrom.html
saviourofall.org/opposers/Landstrom2.html
saviourofall.org/opposers/Er … fAion.html
savior-of-all.com:80/aionian.html

Matt Slick
saviourofall.org/opposers/Exposing.html

SIX WRITINGS REFUTING MATT SLICK OWNER OF THE CARM WEBSITE
indefenceofthecross.blogspot.com … alism.html
tentmaker.org/articles/matt_ … etalk.html
scaredofhell.com/CARMmattsli … uttal.html
city-data.com/forum/christia … slick.html
saviourofall.org/opposers/Slick1Mt2546.html
saviourofall.org/opposers/SlickMark328.html

May the Lord point Matt Slick to Jesus so that he may repent and leave behind the ridiculous doctrine
of eternal torment that slanders the character of God.

KNOWING THE REAL JESUS
godfire.net/eby/godislove.html

WILL JESUS TORTURE BILLIONS FOREVER?
It is absurd to say that Jesus would not be doing it !!!
godfire.net/eby/circularity.html

WHAT JESUS REALLY TAUGHT ABOUT “HELL”
tentmaker.org/articles/jesus … nhell.html

tentmaker.org/forum/arguments-ag … /#msg28882

Tom Logan
saviourofall.org/opposers/To … r1528.html

Hal Lindsey
purposeoflife.org.uk/reply.htm

Dwane
saviourofall.org/opposers/EonLimitGod.html

W. E. Vine
saviourofall.org/poisonfruitofvine.html

A great fifteen chapter introductory series to ultimate reconciliation.
J. Preston Eby does a thorough job covering many aspects of the topic.
Fundamental reading for any person interested in studying universalism from a solid Biblical perspective.
Highly Recommended!
THE SAVIOR OF THE WORLD SERIES EBY
godfire.net/eby/saviour_of_the_world.html

Christian Universalism: Universalist Thought Through Church History Well known Christian church leaders who believed and taught Biblical universalism down through the centuries. Including a separate list of famous people embracing Christian universalism.
tentmaker.org/tracts/Universalists.html

THREE TREASURE HOUSES OF CHRISTIAN UNIVERSALIST ARTICLES
auburn.edu/~allenkc/articles2.html
tgulcm.tripod.com/cu/univart.html
web.archive.org/web/201107132242 … /gtft.org/

THE ORIGIN AND HISTORY OF THE DOCTRINE OF ENDLESS PUNISHMENT
tentmaker.org/books/OriginandHistory.html

OUR HEAVENLY FATHER

According to Jesus, by nature, we are children of the devil (John 8:44).
But over and above that are the words that Jesus spoke to the multitude.
“For One is your Father, Who is in heaven.” (Matt. 23:1&9).

As sinners, by attitude and actions we demonstrate that we are children of the devil.
But by right of creation, and by right of redemption through Jesus Christ, God is the Heavenly Father of everyone, even Satan (Col. 1:20).

For Jesus is the propitiation for our sins, and not for our sins only, but for the sins of the whole kosmos (Greek). (1John 2:2)

Sooner or later, according to His perfect timing for each individual, God will effectively call everyone out of darkness into His marvelous light, first the chosen generation, then all the rest later. (1Peter 2:9; Col. 1:20)

A snippet from THE OUTCOME OF INFINITE GRACE – LOYAL F. HURLEY

Heb. 11:3 should read, “Through faith we understand that the ages were planned by the Word of God.” The ages will collectively end. A literal translation of Heb. 9:26 is, ‘But now, once for all, with a view to the end of the ages, has He been manifested to put away sin by the sacrifice of Himself.’

Throughout the eons there is sin and evil, condemnation and death. At the end of the eons all will be justified (Rom. 5:18,19), and all will be reconciled through Christ’s blood (Col. 1:20).

GOD’S PLAN FOR THE AGES OF TIME
THE EONS OF THE BIBLE WITH CONCORDANCE
saviourofall.org/Tracts/Eons2.html

I believe that the reconciliation of Satan will be the greatest manifestation of God’s grace in action among the celestials
godfire.net/eby/reconcilehvns.html

PAUL

The apostle Paul’s frustration was that, regretfully, he sometimes preferred sinning. The fact that he actually chose sinning demonstrated that, at least momentarily, he preferred it, or he would not have chosen it. It is what we actually do that demonstrates our true preference. We can say we don’t prefer it, but our actions speak louder than words.

Sometimes Paul’s sinful nature was the strongest influence in his life.
Romans 7:14-25 makes it plain that in no way was Paul’s will “free.”

But the Spirit of God taught Paul through experiences that in those times that “the sin that dwelt within him” (v20) preferred sinning; he could then reach out to Jesus for rescue. This God-taught attitude gradually, and no doubt reflexively, became the strongest influence on Paul’s will in his war with his sinful nature.