The Evangelical Universalist Forum

Didn't Jesus Forgive Judas

that’s an excellent point!
he arguably didn’t know what he did…or he wouldn’t have thrown the silver back at the Pharisees and said he’d condemned an innocent man.
but what heart rending grief was his that drove him to suicide :frowning:
i pity him!

I think Jesus forgave him, even in the garden when Judas kissed Jesus, He called Judas “friend”.
Perhaps Jesus reminded Judas that He was still his friend, though Jesus already knew all that had happened - all Judas had done. Just like the rest of us, Jesus knew all the sins we each committed - He bore all our sins, even Judas’. I think the consequences for our sins are still in effect while we are on earth but, forgiveness and salvation are secure.

Jesus called Judas a “devil”…What are the chances someone being in Heaven after being called a “devil” by the Lord? Not good. The only way Judas would be saved if he repented and called upon the name of the Lord before he died. There is no evidence he did this…I don’t think he did… that would be the only way though.

He also called Peter satan

Then when Judas, who had betrayed Him, saw that He had been condemned, he felt remorse3338 and returned the thirty pieces of silver to the chief priests and elders…
— Matthew 27:3
The word for remorse here is ***metamelētheis***3338, from ***metá***3326 (change) and ***mélō***3199 (to care). While ***metanoeite***3340 means a renewal of the mind, metamelētheis indicates a renewal of interest and care. Judas Iscariot had already renewed his mind when he became a disciple (this point is arguable if you believe he was never a believing disciple; but I think John 13:27 makes this unlikely). Having fallen into sin, he had to renew his interest and servitude to Yeshua to return to aionion life. When Peter (who is radically called “satan”) repents Matthew uses even weaker wording to infer repentance (Matthew 26:75). Matthew also uses metamelētheis in a sense that leads to salvation through faith in 21:32. I’m not suggesting that any of this is irrevocable evidence that Judas exercised persevering faith at the end of his life. But I would say that it indicates that we have reasonable grounds to suspect that he did.

What do you make of Matthew (19:28) recording that Yeshua will have His twelve disciples judging the twelve tribes of Israel? I find it unlikely that Yeshua was thinking of Matthias here.

We are so used to thinking of “the devil” and “Satan” with reference to the chief enemy of our souls.

However, these words may be used with respect to their basic meanings.

In John 6:70, Jesus says that one of his disciples is a “diabolos”, a word which means “false accuser”, and that is exactly what Judas was, since he falsely accused Jesus, and turned Him over to the authorities.

Christ announced to his disciples that he was going to die, and Peter replied, “This will never happen to you!” Then Christ addressed him as “satanos”, a word that means “adversary”. To oppose Christ’s intention to die, and deliver people from their sins, is indeed to be an adversary.

more excellent points.
i must say that some of these passages (and others) are why i have been agnostic on the literal existence of satan and his demons for a few years now.

No, Jesus recognized the words were coming from Satan…He wasn’t calling Peter “Satan” per se.

We don’t fight against flesh and blood, but against powers, principalities, spiritual wickedness in high places. Eph 6:12. If you really believe that, Corp, Satan has you right where he wants you.

woe, woe, better watch out corpselight, the debil is gunna getcha :smiling_imp: :laughing: :imp:

Also "What did Jesus mean when he spoke of Judas in this way in Mt 26:24, “… good it were for the man if he had not been born”? Not good. I don’t think Judas is with the Lord guys.

Choosing not to believe in the devil will not protect you from him it only opens the door of your life for him to enter. Eph 4:27

Um yeah. Where does it say that in Eph 4:27 or the surrounding context? Not believing in him opens the door for him to enter. Lets add that to soul faith, and spirit faith. And Eternal separation from God. And Satan is a fallen angel. And even that cherubs are angels. Cleanliness is next to godliness.

It says “Don’t give place to the devil” there are many things you can do to give place to the devil. Your unbelief and sarcarsm is one avenue that does this…

Submit yourself to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you.James 4:7. By your own words you’re not doing much submitting and resisting, Redhot therefore opening your life for attack.

I believe we are way off topic…

Don’t worry I can tread on scorpions. God has not given me a spirit of fear but of power and love and self control. How am I not submitting to God?

Where does it say all the things that give place to the devil? I don’t see sarcasm as one of them. I’ll tell you where it is, but you won’t hear it. To be carnally minded is death. To be spiritually minded is life.

As a result, we are no longer to be children, tossed here and there by waves and carried about by every wind of doctrine, by the trickery of men, by craftiness in deceitful scheming; 15but speaking the truth in love, we are to grow up in all aspects into Him who is the head, even Christ, 16from whom the whole body, being fitted and held together by what every joint supplies, according to the proper working of each individual part, causes the growth of the body for the building up of itself in love.

  17So this I say, and affirm together with the Lord, that you walk no longer just as the Gentiles also walk, in the futility of their mind, 18being darkened in their understanding, excluded from the life of God because of the ignorance that is in them, because of the hardness of their heart; 19and they, having become callous, have given themselves over to sensuality for the practice of every kind of impurity with greediness. 20But you did not learn Christ in this way, 21if indeed you have heard Him and have been taught in Him, just as truth is in Jesus, 22that, in reference to your former manner of life, you lay aside the old self, which is being corrupted in accordance with the lusts of deceit, 23and that you be renewed in the spirit of your mind, 24and put on the new self, which in the likeness of God has been created in righteousness and holiness of the truth.

  25Therefore, laying aside falsehood, SPEAK TRUTH EACH ONE of you WITH HIS NEIGHBOR, for we are members of one another. 26BE ANGRY, AND yet DO NOT SIN; do not let the sun go down on your anger, 27and do not give the devil an opportunity. 28He who steals must steal no longer; but rather he must labor, performing with his own hands what is good, so that he will have something to share with one who has need. 29Let no unwholesome word proceed from your mouth,

Peter is satan

diablos 1228
[Act 13:10 NASB] - and said, "You who are full of all deceit and fraud, you son of the devil[1228], you enemy of all righteousness, will you not cease to make crooked the straight ways of the Lord? (literal sons of the devil?)
[1Ti 3:11 NASB] - Women must likewise be dignified, not malicious gossips[1228], but temperate, faithful in all things.
[2Ti 3:3 NASB] - unloving, irreconcilable, malicious gossips[1228], without self-control, brutal, haters of good,

Uh oh those demon women who run their mouths. Hmm kind of like the CONTEXT of Eph 4

Back to my brick wall :bulb:

well said, redhot…diabolos isn’t a name. it’s a word, and i’m pretty sure it means liar or slanderer.

Kaiser Soze didn’t exist either…but it didn’t stop someone clever using the name to get away with murder, and blame it on him

:smiling_imp: :smiling_imp: :smiling_imp:

that brick wall feels pretty soft after a while, redhot. or is that just that my skull’s been mashed to a pulp?