The Evangelical Universalist Forum

Free Will

I would suggest you read my latest post under the thread Aionios in 2Tim 1:9, Titus 1:2 and Rom 16:25. If you ask me what is “sound doctrine”, it is my personal opinion. Just as yours is personal opinion. That’s also the biggest complaint the Roman Catholic Church and Eastern Orthodox Churches, have against Protestant bodies. My usually method is to ask questions, in the manner of the ancient hero Socrates. So I’ll do that with your answers - going forward.

Scripture isn’t for private interpretation.
That being said I don’t think every doctrine or faction concerns God.
The entire letter 1 Corinthians goes into the variety of factions that are “meaningless arguments” One eats meat anothers concience condemns them, even women what they wear and head coverings, and speaking in church.
If you read the letter in its entirety, you realize Paul was saying there are things that are OK for 1 and condemning to another.

And much is taken out of context because the letter was a letter not pieces of scripture. So when we take pieces and quotes it is good, but we should understand the letter also.

A letter is continuous, Not bullet points. So there is a thread in the letter, to understand our quotes we should understand the basic thread of the letter

Sure. Mormons and Jehovah Witnesses quote scripture. But I don’t see them as mainstream Christian.

A question for you. Why do you think the Protestant canon of scripture is the correct one, as opposed to that of the Roman Catholic Church or Eastern Orthodox Churches?

Paul’s letters are the topics of many sermons I’ve heard. He was dealing with items in the historical churches.

Are we talking about Paul’s letters again? And your point is?

That is an excellent question. It seems that the “canon” accepted by the church system to which we were exposed is for us “the correct one.” I have never seen an objective reply to this question. Indeed, I have never come across a rational basis for accepting some particular “canon” at all. Why do Protestants accept the book of Esther as “inspired” (the Protestant version does not contain the word “God”) whereas they reject Judith. Both books have the same theme: A Godly Hebrew woman saves her people. And why isn’t Clement’s letter to the Corinthians accepted as part of “the canon”? Evidence indicates that the writer was the very fellow labourer of the apostle Paul (Philippians 4:3). This letter was widely read in the early Church along with the letters of the other apostles.

And the idea of the letter can help us understand the quotes so as not to be driven by every wind of doctrine

What is your response, KNH777, to the question I posed - answered by Paidion?

Why do you think the Protestant canon of scripture is the correct one, as opposed to that of the Roman Catholic Church or Eastern Orthodox Churches?

I’m happy you call yourself KNH777 and NOT KHN666. :smiley:

You do realize this “intellectual discussion” can go on, for a long, long time - right? Off to the races, for a while. :laughing:

And the idea of the letter can help us understand the quotes so as not to be driven by every wind of doctrine

And both Mormons and Jehovah Witnesses are cults as well as factions sushi as west borough baptist!
My point is that the Spirit and the Word should bear witness of truth. Neither will contradict each other!

I was raised Catholic recieved Baptism Communion and Confirmation, I went to a Catholic School from k to 8th grade. And I am considering with my dghter sending my granddghter to a Catholic School.
So I don’t think the doctrines in Catholocism are all wrong and the differences are not all that concerning to me.
There are as many Catholics being called as any other.
I think it can be by rote in many congregants, with the ability to rely on following religion and rituals without the experience of “confirmation”
So the question for the Catholic is did you recieve the sacrament of confirmation or the experience of Confirmation.

All that being said…
There was a Protestant movement that factions were movements led by God, calling to wake up, from a very taken over with curruption overshadowing the truth in which the Catholic Church began.

And Salvation by grace and faith was an enlightenment that had been dormant in the power weilded by the political Catholic Church.

So those movements were of God, and even they got screwed up as they grew, and God corrected with the Charismatic movement then that got screwed up and He corrected with the Born again movement. Sounds just like business as usual for God…
Isnt that what He also sid with Israel
Decline in darkness, then light, repeat and again, and again.
Well timed are becoming clearer, eventually it will just be light!

I have to ask KNH777 the **obvious ** questions:

Are you a universalist? Why or why not?
If not, why are you here?
If not, what happens to the “unsaved”?
If so, then what difference does one’s Christian orientation (i.e. Roman Catholic, Eastern Orthodox, Baptist, Methodist, etc.) make?
If so, why do you think your position is more or less right, then that of anyone on this forum?

Anyway, I’m away this evening. So I might have to continue tomorrow. :smiley:

If universalist means everyone will be saved them I’m not a universalist.

I am sorry to hear that, but there is a mucho buncho of evidence given by the fine folks here why you should at least consider the possibility.

Good Luck

I am sorry to hear that, but there is a mucho buncho of evidence given by the fine folks here why you should at least consider the possibility.

Good Luck
I don’t even know what a universalist is. Do you have bullet points?

It’s the doctrine that all will eventually be saved. According to Wiki at Christian Universalism:

There is an article on different Christian positions at Inclusivist (Positions for the Lost). You probably embrace restrictisim - from the article. I embrace inclusivism (which is a majority viewpoint in the Roman Catholic, Eastern Orthodox and Protestant World) amd I’m a hopeful universalist (i.e. I hope it’s true. Technically, I’m a Purgatorial Conditionalist). The article also covers universalism.

Which is why I found it strange - your being here. Folks here are either universalists or want to learn more about it.

The I’ll look it up. I think I just found a post on Google that I was looking to see what others said and it looked like discussions I’d join in on, such as free will and predestination.

I can’t see all being saved
The questions I have is who are all?
All Christian faiths? All people?
What about the two theives on the crosses next to Jesus, 1 obviously Jesus said will be with Him in paradise.
Then what about the terrorist in the planes on 9/11?

And the many scriptures that say the immoral isolators etc won’t enter the Kingdom… etc

I don’t believe Jesus is going to be concerned about our denominations and factions.

And I do believe He will build His end time Bride out of all the sects that are Christian,and will include many Jewish and Muslim and atheist and every walk of life.

So I’m not exclusive on a faith sects of Christianity.
I’m not opposed to people being in any of the sects of Christianity.

I think many can know Jesus and experience being born again where they are. But I think to be his you must be born again of the Spirit, it’s His mark His seal upon us that sets us apart from the world.

We are not complete yet, as others are being called or woken up He is completing a people.
And in the end we will be complete with all those who are His.

As far as what is after for others, Idk or have a firm opinion.
And I have questions about scriptures like Paul delivering one to Satan for destruction of body so soul will be saved.
Then there is the unpardonable sin, and I dont have a firm answer on that either.

But thanks for answering, if you have any input on my thoughts I welcome them.

Honestly I’ve been a Christian for 30 years, and fell asleep through some of it. And I’m just moderate on factions because often the factions are minor doctrines or views like once save always saved or others that you can lose Salvation.
Trinity is a doctrine that is very important, and the death and resurection of Jesus. And as far as sin, I have really been looking at 1 Corinthians and found the degree of conscience and confidence are a main factor in walking a Christian walk.
But that what comes out of our hearts and sin committed with the body such as immorality are condemned by God, but forgivable, and God will wash us as many times as we repent.
And He will also give strength to overcome, and that sometimes takes time for that to happen in our lives.
Real Christians will carry each other and help each other overcome.
But if you are living immorality and not trying to do differently than you will reap those reprecussions until you are ready to release that to His reign in your life. *

Again any input would be appreciated.

Thx!*

I would prefer to defer answers regarding universalism, KNH777, to the actual universalists on this forum. They can address that postion…and answer questions on it…much better than I can. I’ll call them the SMEs (i.e. Subject Matter Experts). :smiley:

Can some folks here, actually help KNH777 out on Universalism :question:

Ok thx