I would suggest you read my latest post under the thread Aionios in 2Tim 1:9, Titus 1:2 and Rom 16:25. If you ask me what is “sound doctrine”, it is my personal opinion. Just as yours is personal opinion. That’s also the biggest complaint the Roman Catholic Church and Eastern Orthodox Churches, have against Protestant bodies. My usually method is to ask questions, in the manner of the ancient hero Socrates. So I’ll do that with your answers - going forward.
KNH777: Holy-Fool-P-Zombie:OK. Let’s try some basic questions:
How can one tell one has a sound understanding of scripture?
Which is better? A biblical correspondence course from Trump University or an online biblical course at Harvard Divinity School?
Who knows more about the bible? A seminary graduate (where the seminar is accredited by a properly recognized body) or someone who has studied on their own?Why can’t you compare the things you think are so far off with what you think is sound doctrine.
I don’t think you need to be a Scolari to read the Bible I think there are several scriptures about being like children, the foolish things made wise, wise made fools etc…So if you have an issue use the Scripture and your explanations and tell me.
I would suggest you read my latest post under the thread Aionios in 2Tim 1:9, Titus 1:2 and Rom 16:25. If you ask me what is “sound doctrine”, it is my personal opinion. Just as yours is personal opinion. That’s also the biggest complaint the Roman Catholic Church and Eastern Orthodox Churches, have against Protestant bodies. My usually method is to ask questions, in the manner of the ancient hero Socrates. So I’ll do that with your answers - going forward.
Scripture isn’t for private interpretation.
That being said I don’t think every doctrine or faction concerns God.
The entire letter 1 Corinthians goes into the variety of factions that are “meaningless arguments” One eats meat anothers concience condemns them, even women what they wear and head coverings, and speaking in church.
If you read the letter in its entirety, you realize Paul was saying there are things that are OK for 1 and condemning to another.
And much is taken out of context because the letter was a letter not pieces of scripture. So when we take pieces and quotes it is good, but we should understand the letter also.
A letter is continuous, Not bullet points. So there is a thread in the letter, to understand our quotes we should understand the basic thread of the letter
Scripture isn’t for private interpretation.
That being said I don’t think every doctrine or faction concerns God.
Sure. Mormons and Jehovah Witnesses quote scripture. But I don’t see them as mainstream Christian.
A question for you. Why do you think the Protestant canon of scripture is the correct one, as opposed to that of the Roman Catholic Church or Eastern Orthodox Churches?
The entire letter 1 Corinthians goes into the variety of factions that are “meaningless arguments” One eats meat anothers concience condemns them, even women what they wear and head coverings, and speaking in church.
If you read the letter in its entirety, you realize Paul was saying there are things that are OK for 1 and condemning to another.
Paul’s letters are the topics of many sermons I’ve heard. He was dealing with items in the historical churches.
And much is taken out of context because the letter was a letter not pieces of scripture. So when we take pieces and quotes it is good, but we should understand the letter also.
A letter is continuous, Not bullet points. So there is a thread in the letter, to understand our quotes we should understand the basic thread of the letter
Are we talking about Paul’s letters again? And your point is?
Why do you think the Protestant canon of scripture is the correct one, as opposed to that of the Roman Catholic Church or Eastern Orthodox Churches?
That is an excellent question. It seems that the “canon” accepted by the church system to which we were exposed is for us “the correct one.” I have never seen an objective reply to this question. Indeed, I have never come across a rational basis for accepting some particular “canon” at all. Why do Protestants accept the book of Esther as “inspired” (the Protestant version does not contain the word “God”) whereas they reject Judith. Both books have the same theme: A Godly Hebrew woman saves her people. And why isn’t Clement’s letter to the Corinthians accepted as part of “the canon”? Evidence indicates that the writer was the very fellow labourer of the apostle Paul (Philippians 4:3). This letter was widely read in the early Church along with the letters of the other apostles.
KNH777:Scripture isn’t for private interpretation.
That being said I don’t think every doctrine or faction concerns God.Sure. Mormons and Jehovah Witnesses quote scripture. But I don’t see them as mainstream Christian.
A question for you. Why do you think the Protestant canon of scripture is the correct one, as opposed to that of the Roman Catholic Church or Eastern Orthodox Churches?
I was raised Catholic recieved Baptism Communion and Confirmation, I went to a Catholic School from k to 8th grade. And I am considering with my dghter sending my granddghter to a Catholic School.
So I don’t think the doctrines in Catholocism are all wrong and the differences are not all that concerning to me.
There are as many Catholics being called as any other.
I think it’s very by rote in many with the ability to rely on following religion without the experience of “confirmation” KNH777:The entire letter 1 Corinthians goes into the variety of factions that are “meaningless arguments” One eats meat anothers concience condemns them, even women what they wear and head coverings, and speaking in church.
If you read the letter in its entirety, you realize Paul was saying there are things that are OK for 1 and condemning to another.Paul’s letters are the topics of many sermons I’ve heard. He was dealing with items in the historical churches.
They are similar to items today. One biggie would be some bowing in compromise to lgbt. Paul deals with that at Corinth “the immoral among you”
Actually all is relevant. I may like a song by ozzie Oz Bourne even though he bit off a head of a bird or something “satanic” well I don’t aspire to the hype in rock music that had the element of elevating demons although I enjoy rock music. As a young Christian I burn my albums. Well my faith was weaker than. Now the draw of rebellion attached has become different in me. So then it was a matter of conscience today it’s just a song. KNH777:And much is taken out of context because the letter was a letter not pieces of scripture. So when we take pieces and quotes it is good, but we should understand the letter also.
A letter is continuous, Not bullet points. So there is a thread in the letter, to understand our quotes we should understand the basic thread of the letter
Are we talking about Paul’s letters again? And your point is?
And the idea of the letter can help us understand the quotes so as not to be driven by every wind of doctrine
KNH777:Scripture isn’t for private interpretation.
That being said I don’t think every doctrine or faction concerns God.Sure. Mormons and Jehovah Witnesses quote scripture. But I don’t see them as mainstream Christian.
A question for you. Why do you think the Protestant canon of scripture is the correct one, as opposed to that of the Roman Catholic Church or Eastern Orthodox Churches?
KNH777:The entire letter 1 Corinthians goes into the variety of factions that are “meaningless arguments” One eats meat anothers concience condemns them, even women what they wear and head coverings, and speaking in church.
If you read the letter in its entirety, you realize Paul was saying there are things that are OK for 1 and condemning to another.Paul’s letters are the topics of many sermons I’ve heard. He was dealing with items in the historical churches.
KNH777:And much is taken out of context because the letter was a letter not pieces of scripture. So when we take pieces and quotes it is good, but we should understand the letter also.
A letter is continuous, Not bullet points. So there is a thread in the letter, to understand our quotes we should understand the basic thread of the letter
Are we talking about Paul’s letters again? And your point is?
What is your response, KNH777, to the question I posed - answered by Paidion?
Why do you think the Protestant canon of scripture is the correct one, as opposed to that of the Roman Catholic Church or Eastern Orthodox Churches?
I’m happy you call yourself KNH777 and NOT KHN666.
You do realize this “intellectual discussion” can go on, for a long, long time - right? Off to the races, for a while.
KNH777:Scripture isn’t for private interpretation.
That being said I don’t think every doctrine or faction concerns God.Sure. Mormons and Jehovah Witnesses quote scripture. But I don’t see them as mainstream Christian.
A question for you. Why do you think the Protestant canon of scripture is the correct one, as opposed to that of the Roman Catholic Church or Eastern Orthodox Churches?
I was raised Catholic recieved Baptism Communion and Confirmation, I went to a Catholic School from k to 8th grade. And I am considering with my dghter sending my granddghter to a Catholic School.
So I don’t think the doctrines in Catholocism are all wrong and the differences are not all that concerning to me.
There are as many Catholics being called as any other.
I think it’s very by rote in many with the ability to rely on following religion without the experience of “confirmation” KNH777:The entire letter 1 Corinthians goes into the variety of factions that are “meaningless arguments” One eats meat anothers concience condemns them, even women what they wear and head coverings, and speaking in church.
If you read the letter in its entirety, you realize Paul was saying there are things that are OK for 1 and condemning to another.Paul’s letters are the topics of many sermons I’ve heard. He was dealing with items in the historical churches.
They are similar to items today. One biggie would be some bowing in compromise to lgbt. Paul deals with that at Corinth “the immoral among you”
Actually all is relevant. I may like a song by ozzie Oz Bourne even though he bit off a head of a bird or something “satanic” well I don’t aspire to the hype in rock music that had the element of elevating demons although I enjoy rock music. As a young Christian I burn my albums. Well my faith was weaker than. Now the draw of rebellion attached has become different in me. So then it was a matter of conscience today it’s just a song. KNH777:And much is taken out of context because the letter was a letter not pieces of scripture. So when we take pieces and quotes it is good, but we should understand the letter also.
A letter is continuous, Not bullet points. So there is a thread in the letter, to understand our quotes we should understand the basic thread of the letter
Are we talking about Paul’s letters again? And your point is?
And the idea of the letter can help us understand the quotes so as not to be driven by every wind of doctrine
And both Mormons and Jehovah Witnesses are cults as well as factions sushi as west borough baptist!
My point is that the Spirit and the Word should bear witness of truth. Neither will contradict each other!
What is your response, KNH777, to the question I posed - answered by Paidion?
Why do you think the Protestant canon of scripture is the correct one, as opposed to that of the Roman Catholic Church or Eastern Orthodox Churches?
I’m happy you call yourself KNH777 and NOT KHN666.
You do realize this “intellectual discussion” can go on, for a long, long time - right? Off to the races, for a while.
I was raised Catholic recieved Baptism Communion and Confirmation, I went to a Catholic School from k to 8th grade. And I am considering with my dghter sending my granddghter to a Catholic School.
So I don’t think the doctrines in Catholocism are all wrong and the differences are not all that concerning to me.
There are as many Catholics being called as any other.
I think it can be by rote in many congregants, with the ability to rely on following religion and rituals without the experience of “confirmation”
So the question for the Catholic is did you recieve the sacrament of confirmation or the experience of Confirmation.
All that being said…
There was a Protestant movement that factions were movements led by God, calling to wake up, from a very taken over with curruption overshadowing the truth in which the Catholic Church began.
And Salvation by grace and faith was an enlightenment that had been dormant in the power weilded by the political Catholic Church.
So those movements were of God, and even they got screwed up as they grew, and God corrected with the Charismatic movement then that got screwed up and He corrected with the Born again movement. Sounds just like business as usual for God…
Isnt that what He also sid with Israel
Decline in darkness, then light, repeat and again, and again.
Well timed are becoming clearer, eventually it will just be light!
I have to ask KNH777 the **obvious ** questions:
Are you a universalist? Why or why not?
If not, why are you here?
If not, what happens to the “unsaved”?
If so, then what difference does one’s Christian orientation (i.e. Roman Catholic, Eastern Orthodox, Baptist, Methodist, etc.) make?
If so, why do you think your position is more or less right, then that of anyone on this forum?
Anyway, I’m away this evening. So I might have to continue tomorrow.
I have to ask KNH777 the **obvious ** questions:
Are you a universalist? Why or why not?
**Idk I have to look it up. Lol. So many labels.
How is Christianity so complicated?
**If not, why are you here?
If not, what happens to the “unsaved”?They perish. "I am the way the truth and the life …"
If so, then what difference does one’s Christian orientation (i.e. Roman Catholic, Eastern Orthodox, Baptist, Methodist, etc.) make?
**None, God isn’t going to ask you what church you attended when He separates the sheep from the goats! **If you are in a religion that prevents your Salvation and keeps you from God, then you will perish because the truth isn’t in you.
"Blind follow blind both…"If so, why do you think your position is more or less right, then that of anyone on this forum?
**I don’t know I think many are right, some are partly right and others I can’t tell if their right, some are just searching. I don’t think someone believing in predestination or if you can lose your Salvation is a big deal! I think walking in the Spirit is.
These factions that divide can’t divide the elect, Because you can’t divide the Spirit of Truth and that’s the common bond of the elect, whether Catholic or Presbyterian. I think there is truth that matter and little things that don’t
I don’t think God is going to ask us our little pet doctrines when He gathers His wheat into His barn. But if we are chaff we will be burned up. So be wheat! Bear fruit! Be one in the Spirit! Love one another!
As a matter of fact the only way the Bible says we can know we are His is by our LOVE for one another. I don’t see anything saying our doctrines say who is who. Love, fruit, abiding in Him that’s all that actually matters!
**
Anyway, I’m away this evening. So I might have to continue tomorrow.
K - safe tavels!https://s3.amazonaws.com/lowres.cartoonstock.com/men-sign-desert-stranded-here-maps-rnin68_low.jpg
Holy-Fool-P-Zombie:I have to ask KNH777 the **obvious **
questions:
Are you a universalist? Why or why not?
**Idk I have to look it up. Lol. So many labels.
How is Christianity so complicated?
**If not, why are you here?
If not, what happens to the “unsaved”?They perish. "I am the way the truth and the life …"
If so, then what difference does one’s Christian orientation (i.e. Roman Catholic, Eastern Orthodox, Baptist, Methodist, etc.) make?
**None, God isn’t going to ask you what church you attended when He separates the sheep from the goats! **If you are in a religion that prevents your Salvation and keeps you from God, then you will perish because the truth isn’t in you.
"Blind follow blind both…"If so, why do you think your position is more or less right, then that of anyone on this forum?
**I don’t know I think many are right, some are partly right and others I can’t tell if their right, some are just searching. I don’t think someone believing in predestination or if you can lose your Salvation is a big deal! I think walking in the Spirit is.
These factions that divide can’t divide the elect, Because you can’t divide the Spirit of Truth and that’s the common bond of the elect, whether Catholic or Presbyterian. I think there is truth that matter and little things that don’t
I don’t think God is going to ask us our little pet doctrines when He gathers His wheat into His barn. But if we are chaff we will be burned up. So be wheat! Bear fruit! Be one in the Spirit! Love one another!
As a matter of fact the only way the Bible says we can know we are His is by our LOVE for one another. I don’t see anything saying our doctrines say who is who. Love, fruit, abiding in Him that’s all that actually matters!
**
Anyway, I’m away this evening. So I might have to continue tomorrow.
K - safe tavels!https://s3.amazonaws.com/lowres.cartoonstock.com/men-sign-desert-stranded-here-maps-rnin68_low.jpg
If universalist means everyone will be saved them I’m not a universalist.
KNH777: Holy-Fool-P-Zombie:I have to ask KNH777 the **obvious **
questions:
Are you a universalist? Why or why not?
**Idk I have to look it up. Lol. So many labels.
How is Christianity so complicated?
**If not, why are you here?
If not, what happens to the “unsaved”?They perish. "I am the way the truth and the life …"
If so, then what difference does one’s Christian orientation (i.e. Roman Catholic, Eastern Orthodox, Baptist, Methodist, etc.) make?
**None, God isn’t going to ask you what church you attended when He separates the sheep from the goats! **If you are in a religion that prevents your Salvation and keeps you from God, then you will perish because the truth isn’t in you.
"Blind follow blind both…"If so, why do you think your position is more or less right, then that of anyone on this forum?
**I don’t know I think many are right, some are partly right and others I can’t tell if their right, some are just searching. I don’t think someone believing in predestination or if you can lose your Salvation is a big deal! I think walking in the Spirit is.
These factions that divide can’t divide the elect, Because you can’t divide the Spirit of Truth and that’s the common bond of the elect, whether Catholic or Presbyterian. I think there is truth that matter and little things that don’t
I don’t think God is going to ask us our little pet doctrines when He gathers His wheat into His barn. But if we are chaff we will be burned up. So be wheat! Bear fruit! Be one in the Spirit! Love one another!
As a matter of fact the only way the Bible says we can know we are His is by our LOVE for one another. I don’t see anything saying our doctrines say who is who. Love, fruit, abiding in Him that’s all that actually matters!
**
Anyway, I’m away this evening. So I might have to continue tomorrow.
K - safe tavels!https://s3.amazonaws.com/lowres.cartoonstock.com/men-sign-desert-stranded-here-maps-rnin68_low.jpg
If universalist means everyone will be saved them I’m not a universalist.
I am sorry to hear that, but there is a mucho buncho of evidence given by the fine folks here why you should at least consider the possibility.
Good Luck
KNH777: Holy-Fool-P-Zombie:I have to ask KNH777 the **obvious **
questions:
Are you a universalist? Why or why not?
**Idk I have to look it up. Lol. So many labels.
How is Christianity so complicated?
**If not, why are you here?
If not, what happens to the “unsaved”?They perish. "I am the way the truth and the life …"
https://s3.amazonaws.com/lowres.cartoonstock.com/men-sign-desert-stranded-here-maps-rnin68_low.jpg
If universalist means everyone will be saved them I’m not a universalist.
I am sorry to hear that, but there is a mucho buncho of evidence given by the fine folks here why you should at least consider the possibility.
Good Luck
I don’t even know what a universalist is. Do you have bullet points?
I don’t even know what a universalist is. Do you have bullet points?
It’s the doctrine that all will eventually be saved. According to Wiki at Christian Universalism:
Christian Universalism is a school of Christian theology which includes the belief in the doctrine of universal reconciliation, the view that all human beings will ultimately be restored to a right relationship with God in Heaven and the New Jerusalem.
There is an article on different Christian positions at Inclusivist (Positions for the Lost). You probably embrace restrictisim - from the article. I embrace inclusivism (which is a majority viewpoint in the Roman Catholic, Eastern Orthodox and Protestant World) amd I’m a hopeful universalist (i.e. I hope it’s true. Technically, I’m a Purgatorial Conditionalist). The article also covers universalism.
Which is why I found it strange - your being here. Folks here are either universalists or want to learn more about it.
“I look to the future because that’s where I’m going to spend the rest of my life.” – George Burns
KNH777:I don’t even know what a universalist is. Do you have bullet points?
It’s the doctrine that all will eventually be saved. According to Wiki at Christian Universalism:
Christian Universalism is a school of Christian theology which includes the belief in the doctrine of universal reconciliation, the view that all human beings will ultimately be restored to a right relationship with God in Heaven and the New Jerusalem.
There is an article on different Christian positions at Inclusivist (Positions for the Lost). You probably embrace restrictisim - from the article. I embrace inclusivism (which is a majority viewpoint in the Roman Catholic, Eastern Orthodox and Protestant World) amd I’m a hopeful universalist (i.e. I hope it’s true). The article also covers universalism.
Which is why I found it strange - your being here. Folks here are either universalists or want to learn more about it.
The I’ll look it up. I think I just found a post on Google that I was looking to see what others said and it looked like discussions I’d join in on, such as free will and predestination.
I can’t see all being saved
The questions I have is who are all?
All Christian faiths? All people?
What about the two theives on the crosses next to Jesus, 1 obviously Jesus said will be with Him in paradise.
Then what about the terrorist in the planes on 9/11?
And the many scriptures that say the immoral isolators etc won’t enter the Kingdom… etc
I don’t believe Jesus is going to be concerned about our denominations and factions.
And I do believe He will build His end time Bride out of all the sects that are Christian,and will include many Jewish and Muslim and atheist and every walk of life.
So I’m not exclusive on a faith sects of Christianity.
I’m not opposed to people being in any of the sects of Christianity.
I think many can know Jesus and experience being born again where they are. But I think to be his you must be born again of the Spirit, it’s His mark His seal upon us that sets us apart from the world.
We are not complete yet, as others are being called or woken up He is completing a people.
And in the end we will be complete with all those who are His.
As far as what is after for others, Idk or have a firm opinion.
And I have questions about scriptures like Paul delivering one to Satan for destruction of body so soul will be saved.
Then there is the unpardonable sin, and I dont have a firm answer on that either.
But thanks for answering, if you have any input on my thoughts I welcome them.
Honestly I’ve been a Christian for 30 years, and fell asleep through some of it. And I’m just moderate on factions because often the factions are minor doctrines or views like once save always saved or others that you can lose Salvation.
Trinity is a doctrine that is very important, and the death and resurection of Jesus. And as far as sin, I have really been looking at 1 Corinthians and found the degree of conscience and confidence are a main factor in walking a Christian walk.
But that what comes out of our hearts and sin committed with the body such as immorality are condemned by God, but forgivable, and God will wash us as many times as we repent.
And He will also give strength to overcome, and that sometimes takes time for that to happen in our lives.
Real Christians will carry each other and help each other overcome.
But if you are living immorality and not trying to do differently than you will reap those reprecussions until you are ready to release that to His reign in your life. *
Again any input would be appreciated.
Thx!*
I would prefer to defer answers regarding universalism, KNH777, to the actual universalists on this forum. They can address that postion…and answer questions on it…much better than I can. I’ll call them the SMEs (i.e. Subject Matter Experts).
Can some folks here, actually help KNH777 out on Universalism
“I look to the future because that’s where I’m going to spend the rest of my life.” – George Burns
Ok thx
Holy-Fool-P-Zombie: KNH777:I don’t even know what a universalist is. Do you have bullet points?
It’s the doctrine that all will eventually be saved. According to Wiki at Christian Universalism:
Christian Universalism is a school of Christian theology which includes the belief in the doctrine of universal reconciliation, the view that all human beings will ultimately be restored to a right relationship with God in Heaven and the New Jerusalem.
There is an article on different Christian positions at Inclusivist (Positions for the Lost). You probably embrace restrictisim - from the article. I embrace inclusivism (which is a majority viewpoint in the Roman Catholic, Eastern Orthodox and Protestant World) amd I’m a hopeful universalist (i.e. I hope it’s true). The article also covers universalism.
Which is why I found it strange - your being here. Folks here are either universalists or want to learn more about it.
The I’ll look it up. I think I just found a post on Google that I was looking to see what others said and it looked like discussions I’d join in on, such as free will and predestination.
I can’t see all being saved
The questions I have is who are all?
All Christian faiths? All people?
What about the two theives on the crosses next to Jesus, 1 obviously Jesus said will be with Him in paradise.
Then what about the terrorist in the planes on 9/11?And the many scriptures that say the immoral isolators etc won’t enter the Kingdom… etc
I don’t believe Jesus is going to be concerned about our denominations and factions.
And I do believe He will build His end time Bride out of all the sects that are Christian,and will include many Jewish and Muslim and atheist and every walk of life.
So I’m not exclusive on a faith sects of Christianity.
I’m not opposed to people being in any of the sects of Christianity.I think many can know Jesus and experience being born again where they are. But I think to be his you must be born again of the Spirit, it’s His mark His seal upon us that sets us apart from the world.
We are not complete yet, as others are being called or woken up He is completing a people.
And in the end we will be complete with all those who are His.As far as what is after for others, Idk or have a firm opinion.
And I have questions about scriptures like Paul delivering one to Satan for destruction of body so soul will be saved.
Then there is the unpardonable sin, and I dont have a firm answer on that either.But thanks for answering, if you have any input on my thoughts I welcome them.
Honestly I’ve been a Christian for 30 years, and fell asleep through some of it. And I’m just moderate on factions because often the factions are minor doctrines or views like once save always saved or others that you can lose Salvation.
Trinity is a doctrine that is very important, and the death and resurection of Jesus. And as far as sin, I have really been looking at 1 Corinthians and found the degree of conscience and confidence are a main factor in walking a Christian walk.
But that what comes out of our hearts and sin committed with the body such as immorality are condemned by God, but forgivable, and God will wash us as many times as we repent.
And He will also give strength to overcome, and that sometimes takes time for that to happen in our lives.
Real Christians will carry each other and help each other overcome.
But if you are living immorality and not trying to do differently than you will reap those reprecussions until you are ready to release that to His reign in your life. *Again any input would be appreciated.
Thx!*
I completely agree with what you shared regarding factions. Christianity in 95% simple faith. The pure milk of the word. Sometimes it seems we spend 95% of our time debating the remaining 5%.
As far as all being saved, I would like to say what I believe being saved “is”. It is not being saved from hell, it is being saved “into Christ”. Connected to the Vine.
Phil 2:9-11 says that “every knee shall bow, whether in heaven or in earth or under the earth, and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord…”
All will be saved into Christ. Not saved “into all faiths”, but "gathered into one in Christ.
Eph 1:9-11 says, In all wisdom and insight 9 He made known to us the mystery of His will, according to His kind intention which He purposed in Him 10 with a view to an administration suitable to the fullness of the times, that is, the summing up(gathering together into one- kjv) of all things in Christ, things in the heavens and things on the earth.
So I believe that evryone will be gathered into one in the Lord Jesus Christ, for there is no other name under heaven given among men whereby we must be saved(Acts 5)
I kno some most folks teach that “every knee shall bow”… most just before they get cast headlong into hell for eternity, but the scriptures say this…
For as in Adam all die, so also in Christ all will be made alive. 23 But each in his own order: Christ the first fruits, after that those who are Christ’s at His coming, 24 then comes the end, when He hands over the kingdom to the God and Father, when He has abolished all rule and all authority and power. 25 For He must reign until He has put all His enemies under His feet. 26 The last enemy that will be abolished is death. 27 For He has put all things in subjection under His feet. But when He says, “All things are put in subjection,” it is evident that He is excepted who put all things in subjection to Him. 28 When all things are subjected to Him, then the Son Himself also will be subjected to the One who subjected all things to Him, so that God may be all in all.
Death will be abolished. God will be “all in all”. Every knee shall bow because all will be subjected and the purpose of that subjection is to be gathered into one “in Christ”.
What does all mean? Who is/are the all?
15 He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation. 16 For by Him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things have been created through Him and for Him. 17 He is before all things, and in Him all things hold together. 18 He is also head of the body, the church; and He is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead, so that He Himself will come to have first place in everything. 19 For it was the Father’s good pleasure for all the fullness to dwell in Him, 20 and through Him to reconcile all things to Himself, having made peace through the blood of His cross; through Him, I say, whether things on earth or things in heaven.
All that He created. All that He is before. All that He holds together. He will have first place in EVRYTHING. All will be reconciled, this is the plan.
Romans 11:32-36 says
For God has shut up **all **in disobedience so that He may show mercy to all.
33 Oh, the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! How unsearchable are His judgments and unfathomable His ways! 34 For who has known the mind of the Lord, or who became His counselor? 35 Or who has first given to Him that it might be paid back to him again? 36** For from Him and through Him and to Him are all things**. To Him be the glory forever. Amen.
Behold I am making ALL THINGS NEW!
If I am lifted up from the earth **I will draw all men unto me!
**
Holy-Fool-P-Zombie: KNH777:I don’t even know what a universalist is. Do you have bullet points?
It’s the doctrine that all will eventually be saved. According to Wiki at Christian Universalism:
Christian Universalism is a school of Christian theology which includes the belief in the doctrine of universal reconciliation, the view that all human beings will ultimately be restored to a right relationship with God in Heaven and the New Jerusalem.
There is an article on different Christian positions at Inclusivist (Positions for the Lost). You probably embrace restrictisim - from the article. I embrace inclusivism (which is a majority viewpoint in the Roman Catholic, Eastern Orthodox and Protestant World) amd I’m a hopeful universalist (i.e. I hope it’s true). The article also covers universalism.
Which is why I found it strange - your being here. Folks here are either universalists or want to learn more about it.
The I’ll look it up. I think I just found a post on Google that I was looking to see what others said and it looked like discussions I’d join in on, such as free will and predestination.
I can’t see all being saved
The questions I have is who are all?
All Christian faiths? All people?
What about the two theives on the crosses next to Jesus, 1 obviously Jesus said will be with Him in paradise.
Then what about the terrorist in the planes on 9/11?And the many scriptures that say the immoral isolators etc won’t enter the Kingdom… etc
I don’t believe Jesus is going to be concerned about our denominations and factions.
And I do believe He will build His end time Bride out of all the sects that are Christian,and will include many Jewish and Muslim and atheist and every walk of life.
So I’m not exclusive on a faith sects of Christianity.
I’m not opposed to people being in any of the sects of Christianity.I think many can know Jesus and experience being born again where they are. But I think to be his you must be born again of the Spirit, it’s His mark His seal upon us that sets us apart from the world.
We are not complete yet, as others are being called or woken up He is completing a people.
And in the end we will be complete with all those who are His.As far as what is after for others, Idk or have a firm opinion.
And I have questions about scriptures like Paul delivering one to Satan for destruction of body so soul will be saved.
Then there is the unpardonable sin, and I dont have a firm answer on that either.But thanks for answering, if you have any input on my thoughts I welcome them.
Honestly I’ve been a Christian for 30 years, and fell asleep through some of it. And I’m just moderate on factions because often the factions are minor doctrines or views like once save always saved or others that you can lose Salvation.
Trinity is a doctrine that is very important, and the death and resurection of Jesus. And as far as sin, I have really been looking at 1 Corinthians and found the degree of conscience and confidence are a main factor in walking a Christian walk.
But that what comes out of our hearts and sin committed with the body such as immorality are condemned by God, but forgivable, and God will wash us as many times as we repent.
And He will also give strength to overcome, and that sometimes takes time for that to happen in our lives.
Real Christians will carry each other and help each other overcome.
But if you are living immorality and not trying to do differently than you will reap those reprecussions until you are ready to release that to His reign in your life. *Again any input would be appreciated.
Thx!*
I completely agree with what you shared regarding factions. Christianity in 95% simple faith. The pure milk of the word. Sometimes it seems we spend 95% of our time debating the remaining 5%.
As far as all being saved, I would like to say what I believe being saved “is”. It is not being saved from hell, it is being saved “into Christ”. Connected to the Vine.
Phil 2:9-11 says that “every knee shall bow, whether in heaven or in earth or under the earth, and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord…”
All will be saved into Christ. Not saved “into all faiths”, but "gathered into one in Christ.
Eph 1:9-11 says, In all wisdom and insight 9 He made known to us the mystery of His will, according to His kind intention which He purposed in Him 10 with a view to an administration suitable to the fullness of the times, that is, the summing up(gathering together into one- kjv) of all things in Christ, things in the heavens and things on the earth.
So I believe that evryone will be gathered into one in the Lord Jesus Christ, for there is no other name under heaven given among men whereby we must be saved(Acts 5)
I kno some most folks teach that “every knee shall bow”… most just before they get cast headlong into hell for eternity, but the scriptures say this…
For as in Adam all die, so also in Christ all will be made alive. 23 But each in his own order: Christ the first fruits, after that those who are Christ’s at His coming, 24 then comes the end, when He hands over the kingdom to the God and Father, when He has abolished all rule and all authority and power. 25 For He must reign until He has put all His enemies under His feet. 26 The last enemy that will be abolished is death. 27 For He has put all things in subjection under His feet. But when He says, “All things are put in subjection,” it is evident that He is excepted who put all things in subjection to Him. 28 When all things are subjected to Him, then the Son Himself also will be subjected to the One who subjected all things to Him, so that God may be all in all.
Death will be abolished. God will be “all in all”. Every knee shall bow because all will be subjected and the purpose of that subjection is to be gathered into one “in Christ”.
What does all mean? Who is/are the all?
15 He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation. 16 For by Him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things have been created through Him and for Him. 17 He is before all things, and in Him all things hold together. 18 He is also head of the body, the church; and He is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead, so that He Himself will come to have first place in everything. 19 For it was the Father’s good pleasure for all the fullness to dwell in Him, 20 and through Him to reconcile all things to Himself, having made peace through the blood of His cross; through Him, I say, whether things on earth or things in heaven.
All that He created. All that He is before. All that He holds together. He will have first place in EVRYTHING. All will be reconciled, this is the plan.
Romans 11:32-36 says
For God has shut up **all **in disobedience so that He may show mercy to all.
33 Oh, the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! How unsearchable are His judgments and unfathomable His ways! 34 For who has known the mind of the Lord, or who became His counselor? 35 Or who has first given to Him that it might be paid back to him again? 36** For from Him and through Him and to Him are all things**. To Him be the glory forever. Amen.
Behold I am making ALL THINGS NEW!
If I am lifted up from the earth **I will draw all men unto me!
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