I would hate for anyone to leave the forum for any reason. Some may feel hurt because we are discussing sodomy. My personal hurt came from my “feelings” that others were striking out at me because of their feelings. I think both “feelings” at different times, trumped our need to instead seek Scripture. I felt persecuted for just trying to state Scripture. My struggle is with the emotional manipulation/control tactics. I grew up with a mom casting spells and manipulating things in the spirit via demons. Because of the authority she had over me and my desire to be loved by her, it created in me a real hurt and anger toward that kind of behavior. I know people may not do that intentionally and I try to maintain a distance between the two (the person and the behavior) but, it still does affect me at a deep level. I’m not sure if I still need healing there or if Yehovah has left that open as a door of discernment.
I’m not real well versed in what you are talking about above. I was not raised in church and my experience with it has (in what I did learn) really turned me away from her interpretations and traditions. I know this may be offensive but, to make my point, it made me sick that christians kept the same pagan holy days that I did growing up which, was for the worship of ancient deities/demons. That was a little weird for me. I’m not well read when it comes to modern critics either which unfortunately, has left me a little embarrassed in my lack of understanding of what you have said above (sorry). My shift to leaving behind eternal torment was based wholly on my further studies after reading Julie’s book. I already had gleaned from Scriptures that God is just and that does not leave room for all people who didn’t “accept Him as Savior” being tormented in an unending state. All that was left was to spend some time in the Greek and comparing Scriptures. Could you explain what you mean by, “Yet most Biblical moralilty makes sense to me in terms of widely recognized conceptions of what love means and does.” I’m sorry, my faith is very untraditional and my understanding of love is to not sin against God or our neighbor then, to go “the extra mile” to help restore our neighbor when I have that oppurtunity. My understanding is, Torah tells us what love “is”, Jesus showed what love “does” by keeping Torah perfectly in the flesh. Had He not, He would not have been a perfect sacrifice and we would still be in our sin. Also, He gave us an example, that we should walk like He did (doing Torah). I am simple in my thinking. I think, God says it and it is good to do.
I do not doubt that the same feelings accompany both heterosexual and homosexual relationships. My thoughts, and what I thought we were discussing on this particular thread was, what God says about it and, is it right to Him. I was raised with the idea that homosexuality was right, that sexual abuse was ok, that witchcraft was normal. I don’t have a background that fosters any judgment toward anyone really. I don’t think anyone is being uncaring toward those in that sin, only just saying, according to the God that was and is and will be, it is sin. If we can’t admit that there are laws at work in the universe that are higher than we are and, realize that we have, at least some personal responsibility to adhere to them, we are saddest of all creatures. My life experience testifies that God have given us discernible, objective, saving, life changing truth in the Scriptures. And, I believe He loves others just as much.
It would be fun to discuss this idea of Jesus breaking Torah if, others are interested. Can we start a thread for that, Bob? I’m not up on the current debates, which would be interesting to hear and discuss.
Thank you, Bob! Peace and joy to you in abundance!